Part II Minute 50 – Lorraine, Defeated

Part 2 Minute-00050

Biff wins and Lorraine stays, but she needs a drink.

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5 thoughts on “Part II Minute 50 – Lorraine, Defeated

  1. Marty: “How could you leave dad for him?!”
    Hamlet: “And what judgment / Would step from this to this?”
    (when he’s confronting his mom about remarrying after his father died).

    The whole situation is Hamlet, with Biff killing George. It’s Hamlet all over. But what’s cool is, instead of seeking revenge like Hamlet does, Marty and Doc focus on setting things right. They see it as their duty, and in doing so, they take responsibility for Biffhorrific ’85. There’s not really time for Marty to even want revenge, or do more than say “You bastard,” when he finds out. His VERY NEXT LINE is, “Doc, you’re not gonna believe this, we have to go back to 1955.” That’s where their objectives lie.

    As has been mentioned before by you guys and in previous comments, Part II’s conflict is with time itself. Marty’s beef isn’t with Biff so much as it is with the wacky timeline. As such, their confrontations with Biff(s) aren’t face-to-face. Changes Doc and Marty make to the space-time continuum affect Biff without him knowing. It’s not until the third movie that an antagonist really gets what’s coming to him, and Marty knocks out Mad Dog Tannen. Like, three times over. (wait it’s five times. He hits him five times because that’s how many Biffs they’ve run into over the course of the series, 1955, 1985, Biffhorrific, 2015, and 1885 omg)

    Changing the subject to Biff and Lorraine’s relationship:
    I also think there’s a control issue involved in Biff keeping Lorraine around so long. As we see later in the movie, he vows to make her his wife, like she’s something to conquer. What if it comes out he doesn’t have what it takes to keep her? If she walks out, what does that mean for his abilities?

    And what does that mean for his image? I wonder what the general public’s opinion of Biff is; do they really see him as a hometown hero, or as a gambling scumball, admired only by the rough crowd? Will his image be less credible if the tabloids report his wife leaving him?

  2. Re: Biff’s image

    When you control the media, you control the message. He very well could be beloved because the public wouldn’t know the real him. When you only get propaganda like the film from the Biff Tannen Museum, it is easy to see how his public image could be portrayed.

  3. It occurred to me that not only do I just randomly talk about things, sometimes it would help to have an idea of when I’m going on about things in relation to the podcast, seeing as how I’ve accidentally anticipated what you three were going to say in the last episode. ^^;

    [One Stockholm Syndrome Minute at a time]
    I would argue that Lorraine doesn’t have Stockholm Syndrome because she’s actually trying to leave Biff before he puts the thumbscrews to her. (I’m not saying that all sufferers from Stockholm Syndrome don’t have that symptom, but it seems off to me to say that Lorraine does.) Personally, I think that Lorraine tells Marty that Biff is right, he deserves their respect, yadda, for at least three reasons (if not more):

    1. Lorraine is trying to mentally get back into the headspace of obeying Biff, which she might need to do in order to exist in his orbit. You have to do things that you don’t want to in order to survive abusive situations, and while Lorraine might not have the means to support herself if she were to actually get away from Biff, she’s survived twelve years with this jerk.

    2. Lorraine is reminding Marty how to survive. If she believes what is coming out of her mouth, she might only believe it at about 10% at this point. The fight has been knocked out of her, and the reason it was is because Biff threatened her kids. Not only that, but one of her kids is right in front of her. The only time that she’s openly startled by Marty’s behavior is when he asks where George is, which makes me think that Charlie Marty is similar to Alpha Marty in that Charlie Marty is offended that he has to be related to this guy, and he wouldn’t want to respect him at all. Lorraine telling him that laundry list could be, “Bide your time, Marty. Wait for the right moment.” (That could also be my Sarah-Connor!Lorraine idea coming out, but still.)

    3. Lorraine really is abused. That one’s kind of a no-brainer, what with Biff openly hitting her in front of his goons and Marty, but part of being abused is the mindset that you were wrong, your abuser was right. Yes, the Lorraine from 1955 is still in there fighting, but twelve years is a long time to not only mourn the one guy that you loved, but to also deal with this complete fucktrumpet (thank you Scottish tweeters about Trump!). After twelve years, even the strongest person would wear down. 🙁

    [01:25 of podcast]
    I think the reason Biff wants Lorraine to stay, despite the fact that he’s canoodling with girls who are at least 10-20 years younger than her, is because Lorraine herself is a status symbol in Biff’s puny mind. He spent years in high school trying to get Lorraine for his girl. He screams as much later on in this movie when she’s got her prom dress and she’s running away from him. “ONE DAY WE’RE GONNA GET MARRIED, LORRAINE! SOME DAY YOU’LL BE MY *WIFE*!”

    If he has her, that means that He’s Won. He’s beaten George McFly in that Lorraine is his, and she will never be George’s again. He’s even beaten Lorraine herself because haha, she ran away from him in high school, but look who’s laughing now, Lorraine! LOOK WHO’S LAUGHING NOW. Oh! Remember the part where she says, “I wouldn’t be your girl even if– even if you had a million dollars!” He’s got the million dollars, *and* he’s got Lorraine after all.

    Lorraine is a possession to him, to abuse and ignore all he wants while he runs around and screws girls. Remember in the museum video where the announcer talks about how Biff married the “love of his life”, Lorraine Baines McFly? Yes, he had a failed marriage or two, but having Lorraine is like Daisy in “The Great Gatsby” — she’s the trophy on his mantlepiece that says he’s the ultimate winner, even more than the millions of dollars he has. She is the ultimate sign of victory.

    (Sorry, I just went off before I listened to the podcast more.)

    [06:43 of podcast]
    Whenever I’m thinking of dark stuff in a canon, I just end up thinking of how it could get even worse, to sort of give myself a pep talk that it’s not as bad for these characters as it *could* be.

    Either that, or I just think of AUs where Lorraine fights back. And hell! Think of it this way — she shoots Biff in the ’90s, because that’s why Biff fades from existence in 2015. Bob Gale confirmed it on a DVD commentary and everything. So, the fact that things are in the shitter for Lorraine now means that they’ll get better when she shoots Biff full of holes. It could be as soon as five years, or it could be as long as fourteen years. No matter what, she’s going to shoot him, and if the cops are sympathetic, she might not even be tried for it, given that Biff was so horrible. The cops had to know about it, given that Biff has absolutely no fear that he’d get arrested for domestic abuse.

    [13:03 on podcast]
    What I thought was bizarre is the fact that there’s something that looks like a nuclear power plant from The Simpsons, and it’s practically across a big yard from a cemetery. Is that the cemetery where they quietly buried irradiated corpses? O_O

    Omgggggggggggggggg, Sean Connery asking if she’s pretty. >_< Heeeeee.

    [16:06 on podcast]
    Maybe it's me, but whenever there's a canon mood where everything is happy-go-lucky, and the dark parts are mostly Fridge Horror moments, I end up liking the idea of really digging into just how dark you can take the characters before it stops being fun anymore, so maybe that's why I like seeing these Hell Valley scenes. I think the only thing that I don't like about them is that they're not executed in the best way. They come across more like cheap jump-scares instead of full-on psychological horror. Haha, Biff's in charge of everything like a mustache-twirling black hat, onoes! Nah, that's not scary. What's scary is the idea if Hill Valley had been left visually untouched, but the people are just like Stepford and there's this psychological, "holy shit, what the fuck is wrong with this town?" kind of vibe to it. Or, if you only focus on the McFlys, have Biff become so much of a master manipulator that he's turned Dave and Linda against their own mother, and holy shiiiiit.

    I dunno, maybe that's just me.

    [17:04 on podcast]
    That's it! That's one of the big reasons that I wince over Part 2 — it's over the top. It's hard to take it seriously when it's hamming things up. Stop chewing the scenery, guys. Omg, spit out that piece of inappropriate bannister, Biff, you don't know where that's been. 😛

    [17:23 on podcast]
    Oh, man, that reminds me! Apparently, they were going to include the deleted scene with Dave, but they couldn't get Linda back because she was pregnant at the time. I think they were going to make her a prostitute or something, iirc? Which is even worse than her being a gold digger, really, because it means she might be maxing out credit cards because she's buying drugs. @_@

    [17:41 on podcast]
    But yes, the tone of BTTF is too light for dark stuff unless you went about it a certain way, and then it would've fallen into Cerebus Syndrome. It's executed badly, and it's anvilicious in its "Look how bad everything is! Look! It's ~terrible!~"

    • Leaper, the format of this comment gave me an insane idea:

      Back to the Future Minute Minute
      in which the hosts analyze every minute of Back to the Future Minute one minute at a time.

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